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New Post: Why did this not kick off?

OlivierNallet — Tue, 02 Apr 2013 23:27:23 GMT

Thanks for the kind words.

Not much progress has been done on this project for few years now. (not enough customers :) )
A lot of people are looking at Mono for a portable C# solution, with some pros and cons.

Languages like C# and Java have not been expanding as much these past few years, probably due to MSFT losing steam, and Oracle not caring much. Most improvements have been on languages / frameworks related to web development (it still feel really inferior to the quality of the C# framework and tools though, but the growth is with mobile platforms now so that drives the efforts).

New Post: Why did this not kick off?

handle477 — Sun, 10 Feb 2013 03:32:47 GMT

What is the status of this project. I think this was a great idea. The 1 review states "I have not tried it".
I've got some C# .net 4 code I would like to try and port to C++.
But, I don't want to do a total rewrite. Would like to be able to use Wine on Linux.
Don't think .net 4 will be running soon on Wine.
The way things are at present. Just feel C# is not the future.
I'm sure you have spent alot of time on this project. Sorry, you have not recieved many accolades for your work.

New Post: CrossNet "Marketing"

mapson — Sat, 03 Jul 2010 07:56:29 GMT

Hi,

No idea why my previous post had all its formatting removed, I have fixed it up now.

Have you considered using a C++ Garbage collection library?

It seems the most commonly used is the Boehm-Demers-Weiser Conservative GC - there is a Wikipedia entry on it, search for "Boehm garbage collector". Mono even uses it currently (though they are looking to replace it, if it has been okay up until this point it must be pretty reasonable).

Unsure if using this GC would create problems for supporting some platforms you are interested in. There is also a GC called TinyGC which aims to use the same API as the Boehm GC, run on memory constrained platforms/be small/portable etc, but that doesn't appear to support c++ at this point in time.

Possibly worth considering if you haven't already.

- Mike

New Post: CrossNet "Marketing"

OlivierNallet — Wed, 30 Jun 2010 07:32:30 GMT

Hi Mike,

Thanks for the kind words :)

My target audience was more game companies, but you are right - I am not linux guy - I overlooked another potential market (actually maybe bigger :)).

In the past few months, I started to play again with CrossNet (runtime compiling on gcc, not the generated code yet though, 2010, last reflector release...). This has been paused a bit as I recently changed job and moved from FL to WA. Depending how much free time I have with my new employer, I hope to have enough time to continue working on it.

Thanks for the advices on the marketing side, I initially did not want to oversell the project and am not that focused on it, it was mostly a pet project at the time. Also there was some conflict of interests with my previous employer, but it is over now :).

I'll keep your priorities in mind for the next release. I will need help on the GC for the multiple thread though, as it is going to be a real PITA :).

Regards,

Olivier

New Post: CrossNet "Marketing"

mapson — Tue, 29 Jun 2010 11:57:03 GMT

Hi Olivier, Thanks for creating CrossNet and releasing it online, I think it is a great idea and has a lot of potential! I appreciate that the community involvement picking up CrossNet and running with it may not have been as high as you may have hoped to date, I have a few thoughts on this which may be worth considering based on my experience of finding the system. I eventually stumbled across the CrossNet codeplex pages in March 2010... I had been looking off and on for a period of 2 years prior for any tools that could assist in translating some projects I have worked on from c# to c++ in a way that included a light weight garbage collector - I want to be able to develop in C# but have the code translated/converted to create c++, and then run/compile on windows/linux/freebsd boxes - much like your workflow. My main drivers and requirements were slightly different than how you currently "position" CrossNet: 1. Speed/Performance 2. Security (Seeing reflector with some of the addons which automatically convert and export entire MSIL assemblies to C# is an eye opener for those unaware - I realise there are tools to make this less straight forward, but the point still remains) 3. Not requiring end users to install Mono/have a specific version of the .net framework installed. 4. On some platforms Mono might not be available/work too well - older versions of freebsd when I was originally looking for example. My searches used terms like "c# to c++ translater", "c# to c++ translator", "c# to c++ converter", "c# to c++ convertor"... I didn't come across your site at all. I eventually accidentally stumbled across your site while on another site like codeproject - though not specifically looking for a convertion tool at that point in time. I downloaded CrossNet in March 2010, created a temp directory to play around with one of my projects for a day or so - started looking good but I discovered I had a large task to convert my code in my nunit tests to no longer use extension methods (introduced in .net v3.0). I put that on hold as I had other things come up with work... 3 weeks ago I decided to start back on it... I couldn't remember the temp directory nor the name "crossnet"... spent 1 hour trying to refind the website on the net - went back to all my old search terms and didn't find it there either. Earlier tonight just bumped into a generated c++ piece of code on my machine with the crossnet header at the top - so starting again with CrossNet. The point of all the above is - I think your product is great (obviously alpha at this stage, but huge potential). I believe CrossNet is missing out on a large chunk of potential userbase due to not appear in the search engine results for the way some of the potential users are searching. Here are some thoughts: 1. Does coreplex provide you stats with number of visitors over time etc? Perhaps you could consider spending a little more time on adding to the front page other uses and include the keywords I used to see if traffic patterns improve and more interest is shown in the project? 2. In my view the getting started page should also be directly linked to from the front page and in another colour or something so it stands out more... most people want to jump straight into it - I ended up using the wiki search page looking for "start" after rereading all of the discussion points... I had got distracted with other links on the site and didn't find the Home->Overview->Getting Started path. 3. Once people find the site, getting them to try the system is another aspect... I appreciate you may not want to spend huge amounts of time due to the levels of interest to date, but just doing a minor refresh to the code... making it work with the latest reflector release with no reported errors and including a visual studio 2008 based solution would prevent the project looking like it hasn't had a release since 2007. Even doing no changes but just a new version number and 2010 upload date can go a long way to avoiding the appearance of an abandoned project ;). I am going to have to hack something up along those lines and would be happy to send it to you if that would save you some time - let me know if you would like me to. There are lots of other things that could be done (working with gcc, then working against .net v3.5 assemblies would be two features high on my list - threads will become more and more important with multicore processors becoming the norm), but the above 3 points above I think could increase the interest for the least amount of effort on your part. Thanks again for releasing the tool and all the work you have put in so far! Cheers, - Mike

New Post: .Net Reflector could not resolve Reflector.CrossNet

OlivierNallet — Wed, 12 May 2010 01:38:10 GMT

Ok, so good news, the support is much better than before, so I had an answer within hours.

I just tested and I have things working again... (although because I am in the middle of adding support to gcc, so I have unrelated compiler errors in the generated C++ code. So not sure it is 100% generated correctly yet).

The parameter "/select:Reflector.CrossNet" is not necessary anymore. Actually now, it creates some issues, so you can remove it. I will update the setup wiki page.

To fix the crash that I had, you need to replace the method CrossNet.Net.Provider.Initialize() in the project CrossNetParser, like this:

public static void Initialize()

{

sServiceprovider = new Reflector.ApplicationManager(null); // Concrete types are not obfuscated anymore, so we can create them directly

sAssemblyManager = (IAssemblyManager)sServiceprovider.GetService(typeof(IAssemblyManager));

sTranslatormanager = (ITranslatorManager)sServiceProvider.GetService(typeof(ITranslatorManager));

}

Let me know how it goes, but now that was back on track.

>> I wonder how many other Reflector add-ins have been so mercilessly broken.

That impacted only CLI usage, which was not officially supported at the time anyway. I may have been one of the rare add-in to really need it. :) Although the errors in the XML file are not reported, so best at first is to run under Visual Studio and exceptions turned on in case you don't have the expected output.

>>…Diversion, but, another thing; you’ve got a really great product in the making. Have you considered weaning the project completely off Reflector and perhaps, going with stuff like expression trees and open source components like SharpDevelop's NRefactory? A lot more work, but there is no AOT for C# .NET; add on a compiler and you are well poised to be the first

Thanks you for the kind words. I thought about it several times but 3 years ago there was not that many API allowing that. (Reflector was the only serious one I found). Things may be different now. Given that Mono is not a great solution for X360, PS3 and Wii. And it not officially possible anymore for iPhone and iPad, I guess CrossNet has still some use :). If only a game studio wanted to help the dev of CrossNet :).

Cheers,

Olivier

New Post: .Net Reflector could not resolve Reflector.CrossNet

AsameObiomah — Tue, 11 May 2010 18:22:26 GMT

Thanks for that.

I have some older versions of Reflector hanging about, so I'll give them a whirl and see it all goes well while I await your feedback. Its a bit cheeky of Redgate to change things that way, I wonder how many other Reflector add-ins have been so mercilessly broken.

…Diversion, but, another thing; you’ve got a really great product in the making. Have you considered weaning the project completely off Reflector and perhaps, going with stuff like expression trees and open source components like SharpDevelop's NRefactory? A lot more work, but there is no AOT for C# .NET; add on a compiler and you are well poised to be the first.

New Post: .Net Reflector could not resolve Reflector.CrossNet

OlivierNallet — Tue, 11 May 2010 03:32:30 GMT

Thanks a lot for the feedback!

So it appears that with a more recent version of Reflector (I guess due to some refactoring by Red-gate) the behavior of Reflector is different.

When using the version from Mid-February, I do get the same annoying error message, but it actually does not change the behavior of the code. If you put a breakpoint in the method of Provider (in the Project CrossNetParser/Net), the methods are actually executed. However there is a much bigger issue. Assembly.GetTypes() does not work, it dies because of some unknown token .NET token (huh!?! some sort of protection?).

This last issue prevents the creation of the service provider that give access to the Reflector API. As of today, this is a blocking item :(. I'll talk to some people at red-gate to see if this can be resolved. I suppose that you could use an older version of Reflector - assuming that auto-update has been deactivated with the switch to red-gate (I have some in my archives but I don't know if legally I can give you access to them).

Unfortunately I don't have an ETA. Sorry about that, I will keep you posted.

Regards,

Olivier

New Post: .Net Reflector could not resolve Reflector.CrossNet

AsameObiomah — Mon, 10 May 2010 03:15:10 GMT

Hi, I will greatly appreciate some help.

I have had issues with getting started and am getting the error; ".Net Reflector could not resolve Reflector.CrossNet". The Relector version is 6.1.0.11 and all CrossNet projects have compiled successfully.
All steps up to 4.5 at http://crossnet.codeplex.com/wikipage?title=started&referringTitle=Overview (see red, bolded text in extract below).

Run Reflector.exe, select .NET 2.0 runtime version (it should not matter but never know).

Go in View -> AddIns, and add Reflector.CrossNet to the list of add-ins.
If you regularly use Reflector make sure that the optimization mode is set to .NET 2.0 (not 3.0+).
Close Reflector.exe.
Open the command prompt (run cmd.exe) and go in the folder where Reflector.exe is located (and the 2 other dlls).
Type: Reflector.exe /select:Reflector.CrossNet /crossnet:C:\TempFolder\Reflector.CrossNet\Example.xml
This will show Reflector UI for few seconds and should close it after a short beep.
If you go in CrossNetBenchmark folder you should see the C++ sources updated.

So far, I have discovered that the first part of the command should include the Reflector.CrossNet.dll like so; "Reflector.exe /select:Reflector.CrossNet Reflector.CrossNet.dll", but even with that, the error persists.

New Post: Is somebody interested to adapt CrossNet to iPhone / iPad?

OlivierNallet — Thu, 06 May 2010 05:45:16 GMT

Hello,

As you probably heard, Apple is only allowing applications using C, C++ and Objective-C.

Here is one of the links talking about this, but there are many more:

http://venturebeat.com/2010/04/08/apple-bans-flash-to-iphone-conversions-in-apps/

It seems that the purpose is to prevent other companies to define a framework that would be integrated in Apple's apps (like Flash, MonoTouch, Unity 3D, etc...).

While I developed CrossNet, I saw more momentum gathered around Mono, and I supposed that at one point or another there would be an iPhone version. It happened last year with MonoTouch, making CrossNet not as relevant on that particualr platform. This was not a major motivator for me to make it work on that particular platform.

But because CrossNet generates C++ code, that makes it a valid alternative. (provided that the generated C++ compiles on the Apple compiler and that the computer has a double O.S. - Apple O.S. to compile the iPhone app, but .NET enabled to run the .NET tools). There must be other .NET alternatives on iPhone though. (do you have some links?)

In any case, if you feel interested by the challenge :), you are welcome to adapt CrossNet on the iPhone O.S. I may be able to help as well :).

Cheers,

Olivier

New Post: .NET Reflector Alternatives

OlivierNallet — Mon, 05 Apr 2010 03:05:03 GMT

Hi Solidus,

CrossNet is .NET based (written in C#), so my assumption was that anyway the end user would have access to some .NET runtime.

You can try to use Mono to see how it works, I think that .NET reflector has some unmanaged code and I don't know if Mono supports that (hopefully it will). Another possibility is to use a Virtualized Machine (Yeah, I realize that it's not great).

About the generated C++ code, the story is a bit different. Although the runtime and generated code is not compatible with GCC, I recently worked on the runtime so it would compile under GCC. The generated code has not been made compatible yet, but it should be possible (and maybe easier).

I unfortunately can't work on it in the next month or two, but I intend to fix this over time. So if you resolve the .NET reflector issue and you still need support for GCC let me know, I will help you.

Cheers,

Olivier

New Post: .NET Reflector Alternatives

Solidus117 — Mon, 05 Apr 2010 00:23:32 GMT

Hi,

I work on a Linux machine and access to Windows machines for development using CrossNet is limited. I'm intending to use CrossNet to develop for embedded devices that use the gcc toolchain and was wondering if you knew of any workarounds to let me use something else instead of .NET Reflector/VS?

New Post: how to use this

OlivierNallet — Thu, 05 Nov 2009 05:38:48 GMT

Sure!

Please have a look into the "How to get started" discussion - April 21st 2009.

Let me know if you have any questions.

Regards,

Olivier

New Post: how to use this

divyang4481 — Wed, 04 Nov 2009 06:14:43 GMT

Hi all,

Please give some note for how to use this hence new developer like me can understand about how to do that

New Post: that's a too big task for only one developer

OlivierNallet — Sat, 10 Oct 2009 03:19:52 GMT

Hello,

Hmm, I'm not sure I understand what you are saying.

CrossNet is just the runtime components, so as such the number of types is relatively limited (only base types and interfaces are supported). And this is on purpose to scale the full .NET down to the core portion. The other project (CrossNetSystem) is a skeleton for 0.001% of the .NET BCL. Just to show how this can be done and to be improved over time. Nothing prevents the end user to actually use Mono BCLs (which I believe is not GPL) for a bigger covereage of the BCL.

The purpose of CrossNet is to provide the runtime for lightweight platforms that have a C++ compiler (like mobile phones, game consoles, embedded systems, etc...) and in these case the users don't need full BCL anyway, just the core components.

Regards,

Olivier

New Post: that's a too big task for only one developer

dmihailescu — Wed, 07 Oct 2009 15:55:12 GMT

Your intention is commendable but the means to achieve that loafty goal are not there.

If I were you, I would try to scale back the scope of this project to support only certain types and features.

In order to help the developers to use only the features supported, I would creeate an assembly or type attribute similar to AttributeCLSCompliant, to signal when non compliant types or features are used.

It would be up to the developer to use this attribute only when needed.

New Post: How to get started

OlivierNallet — Tue, 21 Apr 2009 04:27:15 GMT

Hi,
I tested everything from scratch and documented every single steps in the "How to get started page".
Let me know if there is something not clear or missing.
Regards,
Olivier

New Post: How to get started

OlivierNallet — Thu, 16 Apr 2009 04:48:04 GMT

Hello,
I guess it doesn't help when the wiki now incorrectly parses the text "C++" and underline every pages entirely. :)

Actually the "how to get started" page describes a workflow that is not enabled anymore. Sorry about that, I'll fix the page in the next few days.
In the meantime, you can read the steps in the download page (with the release) as they are accurate - although I did not test with the very latest reflector version (will do this week-end to make sure there is no new issue there).

The best to get started is to use the C# benchmark example. It has everything needed with the current release of CrossNetSystem.
And get you a simple framework to start with. As indicated in the steps, you will have to update some of the pathing for include paths and libraries to match your local configuration.

About Mono BCL, if you have the assemblies directly you should be able to pass them as is with CrossNet parser. (You may be able to download them directly from the mono website).
Now I would not put my hope too high. The reason is that they certainly depend on a ton of other assemblies or low level code / pinvoke.
CrossNetParser will parse it, and generate the whole cpp code. Potentially it will compile it correctly (depending of some edge cases not supported or referencing other assemblies) but I don't believe it will link.
A better choice is to take the C# sources of the Mono BCL and disables everythying that you don't need, recompile the C# code with DevStudio and generate the C++ from that new assembly.
This makes it much more manageable and you will integrate things one at a time with full control.
That's the process I did when I integrated the Mono unit-tests in my test framework, but the BCL was pointing to my local implementation (a variation of CrossNetSystem).

I hope it helps!
Cheers,
Olivier

New Post: How to get started

claudiolyra — Wed, 15 Apr 2009 19:40:06 GMT

Hello Olivier.

Your project is very interesting and I am sorry to see you have discontinued it.
I would like to give it a try but the information in your site is a little bit limited and some references seem do not match the actual download (for example, I am not sure to what are you referring to when you mention the CrossNet Console).
Can you give some short step-by-step tutorial on how to get started porting an assembly? For example, I have seen the explanation on the use of the parser with the Reflection command line but I am not sure how to convert the Mono BCL into c++ in the first place (is it enough to have Mono installed in the machine? What to do then?)
I am kind of confused and I would strongly appreciate your help to get jump started in playing with it.

Again, congratulations for your project and I am looking forward to listening from you soon.

Salute!

New Post: Roadmap, platforms targeted, memory footprint...

OlivierNallet — Mon, 13 Apr 2009 04:17:21 GMT

Bonjour Chris! :)
Sorry for the delay.

>>Do you still devote some time on it?

Right now, I do not devote any time on CrossNet, for a couple of reasons:
- The latest point release contained enough features / was stable enough to be used as a good starting point.
- Although I receive here and there emails from people using it (like cellphone and video-game companies...), there is not enough traffic for me to justify spending much more time on the implementation :).

Now things could change (i.e. I could get back to it) quickly if I feel that customers were interested by a more active participation and there was a bigger "live" community. :)
I always answer support questions though (mostly offline) and do my best to help people get started.
And I'm always open for new contributions.

>>What's the roadmap for it?

Most of .NET 2.0 features are supported. (A big one missing though is everything related to multi-threading).

You can find here the features that could be added relatively easily (but are not critical for most embedded projects):
http://crossnet.codeplex.com/Wiki/View.aspx?title=Features%20to%20be%20supported%20soon

And here the features that are not going to be supported as either it's a ton of work, a big memory cost or cannot be "emulated" in C++.
http://crossnet.codeplex.com/Wiki/View.aspx?title=Features%20not%20expected%20to%20be%20supported%20soon

That being said, the biggest amount of remaining work is related to the BCL implementation (CrossNetSystem is just a basic framework). But usually people are just re-implementing the small set they are using or use the Mono implementations.

>>If I understand well Crossnet, it would allow to avoid having the whole "fat" .NET/Mono CLR and to just have a lightweight environment. Am I right?

Yes, CrossNet is extremely lightweight. Just the bare minimum. For a complex project, most of the cost will depend on the BCL usage though.
Also some features (like reflection) are not supported mostly for memory reasons. If one wants a full .NET compatibility / feature set, then Mono would be a better fit, but unlike CrossNet the commercial license is not free.

Do not hesitate if you have more questions.
Cheers,
Olivier